HELP - Water Filter!

imported
#1

I have inquired about gravity-fed water filters before on this site and without much response, so I’m hoping this post survives…

I have found several different Co.'s which make gravity-fed water filtration systems:

1 - http://www.katadyn.net/katadyn_camp.html

2 - http://www.generalecology.com/firstneeddelux.htm

Now, in my head, this is how I imagine it all working (please, correct me if I’m wrong in my logic):

Arrive into camp, and first thing is first–I need water! So, with my gravity-fed filter-bag, down to the watering hole I go. I scoop a couple of liters, walk back to camp, hang the bag, set the hose, and let it do its thing. Meanwhile, I set camp and begin to prepare dinner for the evening. After 10, 20, or 30 minutes, enough water should be ready to suffice the evening’s immediate needs–re-hydrating my body and cooking. After dinner is complete, and depending on the situation, of course, I’ll make another trip to the watering hole for another few liters in which I allow to filter overnight for use first thing in the morning. Moreover, if, throughout the day, I stumble across a good water source and I decide to get water while it was available, I could take the filter-bag out, scoop the water up, hang it, then proceed to rest, nap, read, draw, listen to the radio, or reflect while waiting on the water to process through into safe, clean, thurst-quenching, chemical-free, life-giving water!

Now, my question is this, am I diluted into thinking filtering safe water can be this easy? And have many of you 2000-milers seen people using this system on the trail before?

Please–anyone!–give me feedback if you have any additional information–either about another Company who makes such a filter or to support/oppose my ideas. My thoughts need authentication…

Thanks, peeps!

Dawg

“If you are not planning, then you are planning to fail.”

Dawgtrekker

#2

My guess, not that its a cool system all, but do you want to send that much time “making water”? For example, its 99*, the black flies are eating your face off and you have no water. A. you hover pump a qrt qith your Hiker B. you use your Aqua Mira C. you use your friends pump D. you suck face right out of the puddle. Way to many times I need water NOW. But then I do live on the edge when I hike. I also max the days hours and get into camp with only a few minutes of daylight too. It works, but its not to speedy if time ever gets to be a problem. Juss a thought, oh Dawgidy Dawg Dawg.

Bushwhack

#3

I do not see any upside to the Katadyn gravity filter. It is slow (“up to 5 liters per hour”) and heavy (27oz). What about it appeals to you relative to, say, the Katadyn Hiker?

Eric

#4

Most of the hikers I met chose A - Aqua Mira, Iodine, chlorine or some sort of tablet for the weight advantage B - a filter for “speed” advantage or C - nothing for both weight and speed. Ask yourself what advantage does this provide over the other systems. I am kind of curious about what these gravity systems weigh.

I used a combinatiion Aqua Mira “squeeze filter bottle” for quick refreshment along the Trail and the Aqua Mira drops to treat water in camp. Of course, I filled my hydrator before leaving town. I only went through 2 sets of the liquid drops the whole hike (although I did run out in the 100 mile wilderness and drank straight from the source)

Good luck with your hike!

Skeemer

#5

Well, Eric, The Katadyn Hiker is an option at this point. I have hiked with a traditional pump filter before (MSR) and frankly, at the end of the day, when you are tired and exhausted, and out of water, it sucks having to pump. I know, I know, then use Aqua Mira for its weight and effectiveness benefits, right? In general, I’m not opposed to Aqua Mira for situations like the one outlined in Buskwhack’s example above. However, I have used chemicals and really just don’t care for the taste–it makes drinking water (something I love) burdensome. Also, you could say that I am somewhat “uptight” when it comes to my body and what goes in it – hey, everyone has their scruples! So, on the premise, I plan on carrying Aqua Mira/Chlorine/Polar Pure solely as a Risk Management tool – a backup if the gravity bag tears, the filter manfunctions, or if I’m just too damned tired to do anything. Otherwise, in most situations, I would favor a filter over chemicals. Although, I do hear what you are saying about the weight of the Katadyn gravity filter. I have scrutinized the Katadyn at my local outfitter and found it to be sort of an over-kill on the design of the bag, which accounts for most of its weight. In addition, I want to say it has a 10-liter max capacity, which, for my intent, is also an overkill. That being said, I have read Ray Jardine’s book in which he speaks about making your own gravity-fed system; however, Jardine fails to say which filters are compatible with the gravity-fed feature. Furthermore, Jardine’s design is much more simple, seems to weigh significantly less, and capacity can be taylored to meet individual needs. For instance, I would make about a 6-7 liter max capacity bag of sil-nylon and a incorporate a longer hose. As far as the 5-liter an hour claim, I imagine I could work with that “downside” too–afterall, that’s 12 minutes per liter compared to 1 liter per minute with the Katadyn Hiker or MSR Miniworks. So, like I mentioned, I guess I could deal with the slow filter rate as mentioned in my earlier post (relax, nap, eat, read, write, etc) for 12-25 minutes. And I guess I rationalize it in my head like this: once the first liter is completed, I can drink it, and satify that immediate thurst. After that, I suppose I really don’t care how long it takes. If I’m at camp for the night, I have to be there anyway, right? So what’s the big deal if the 6-liters I plan on using the next day takes 6 minutes or 66 minutes to finish? Chances are I’ll have plenty of other things to occupy that time. There’s always Skeemer’s suggestion, too – carry the “squeeze bottle filter”.

I understand there are many means to the same end. My thing is, what will work best for me? I am still curious if anyone has used or seen people use a similar gravity-fed filter – either homemade or prefab. All replies welcome…

Thanks to those who have advised me already!

Any other takers?

Mad Love, Dawgtrekker

“If you are not planning, then you are planning to fail.”

Dawgtrekker

#6

Sarge has one of them thingies. It gravitates all night…or it leaks across the shelter floor. I can’t rememeber ever being to tired to pump some water. To tired to eat but never to tired to drink. Only you can tell what works best for you. Unless we tell you otherwise. :>#

Bushwhack

#7
  1. All hikers naturally filter water when they get it without even knowing it. i.e. they get it from the best water pool available, and they don’t suck it off the bottom of the pool with sediment, etc. They try to get it as clean as they possibly can—and this is filtering in and of itself.
  2. Having said 1), the water can still have unseen bad things in it which will make you sick so you need to further filter it or treat it with chemicals.
  3. Chemicals are best for hikers for a number of reasons, i.e. weigh a lot less than filters, filters weigh a lot and are bulky, filters ice up, filters clog, etc.
  4. Nature gravity filters water naturally in streams as they flow and as water seeps down into the deep underground streams. Gravity filters are a good way to go if you have the time to wait for gravity to work. It takes months for water to work it way down to several hundred feet beneath the earth.
  5. Many drilled wells have iorn water (bad taste, yucky stuff) and other bad taste stuff in them. So wells often use filters to clear up milky and/or bad tasting water. Some in line filters are used and some sand filters are used (let the water gravity feed down thru the sand). It really takes the iorn taste out of water and the water is nice and clean and tastes great.
  6. Gravity filters, you have to change the sand in them or whatever filter material is used every so often, just like you have to change the filter in a regular water filter. The sand in a gravity filter gets yucky with all the stuff it filters out of the water, etc.

So ditch the filter, use chemicals to kill the nasty stuff and then after 30 minutes or so to let the chemicals work, pop a vitimin C pill in the water, to get rid of the chemical taste. Works great, tastes great.

Hope all this sheds some light on the subject.

See you out there. :cheers

Maintain

#8

There are valid arguments for chemical treatments as well as for filtering. Like all backpacking equipment, you see a variety of methods used by thru-hikers. There is no clear consentous on which is best.

Myself, my preference is the Pur (Katydin) Hiker filter. It pumps faster than others, and no waiting until I can drink it. I rationalize the ounces of weight by carrying less water, and not carrying drink mixes.

Gravity filters? It really isn’t that big a deal to filter the 4 liters that I need in the evening, plus a couple of liters during the day.

Peaks

#9

You don’t like the taste? What taste? I’ve been using it for, um, hell, I dunno, a long time. Maybe I’m just used to it, but I don’t think water treated with aqua-mira has a taste…

Personally, I don’t see why you’d carry a filter that’s slow and weighs 2 pounds. It’s a great idea, but probably better for carcamping.

Dog Tag

#10

Maintain, Peaks, Dog Tag,

Thanks for the replies. All of these questions are helping me “filter” all the information out there on the subject-- what works best and what does not.

As far as carrying a filter that pushes two pounds, I’d modify the design to the range of 10-15 ounces.

I still have time to figure it all out, though. If I work on this for a couple of weeks, and decide that the whole systems sucks, then no problem – at least I know that my final filter decision was and is best for me. But, I am going to continue to work on this idea – try to improve flow rate, weight, durability, etc. etc. I think I’ll see about contacting Jardine, if that’s possible. Anyone know how to track him down?

Mad Love, Happy Trails ~

Dawg

Dawgtrekker

#11

And adding V-C kills the taste? Interesting! I’ll have to try that at home and then maybe I’ll be able the tolorate the chemical taste, or not…

Dawg

Dawgtrekker

#12

Dawg, i like the stuff yer thinking up. Maybe you could market yer new design and make a mint and do the rest of yer hiking on us! a true plus of inovation and thinking outside the “canned thinking”.

I use the PUR older Katahdin Hiker. It does great and i add the coffee filter idea, cause some of the mud puddles i had and will have to take water from do not allow me to avoid sediment. prefiltering is a great option to save the hike lie of my pump filter.

some of the water sources in GA are actually less than 1" deep. I could have taken the time to build a small improvised dam so my source would be deeper. Not one other soul thought of that before me, cause I had the 1" water source to fool with myself. Maybe next year, I’ll build tiny dams around these shallow trickles, so that the people who follow won’t have to avoid sediment like I did. I am planning on taking more time to smell the roses, and I have a better idea about how much time it takes me to get to where I want to be.

Your idea makes great sense to me and may be a trail bonus for those who follow as well. GOOD LUCK…see ya in aught four!

Burn

burn

#13

Here I am at work, reading about water filters. I open my next work order. It’s for 2 ea 20" micro filters being shipped to Singapore. Of course, they’re 294x32x42" and 5000# ea, so I don’t think they’d be suitable for backpacking. Oh, well.
Myself, I like the Pur Hiker. :smokin

Harry Dolphin

#14

This gravity filter thing sounds like a crock. Go with the tried and true. I have a Pur Hiker and it works just fine, and don’t have to wait for my water.

steve hiker

#15

Dawg dude,

Firstly, the gravity idea is a good one. If you’ve got Ray Jardines book “Beyond Backpacking”, he explains how to make a gravity filter.

Secondly, you can contact Ray via his website which is:

www.rayjardine.com

There you go, nice “n” easy.

I think his gravity filter uses the cartridge from a “Hiker” filter. Not so quick but leaves time for other stuff while in camp. I like the idea.

See you out there

Ross

Ross

#16

Well, Dawg, if you’re determined to carry a gravity filter, at least carry a chemical backup in case gravity fails. :wink:

Eric

#17

My regular setup is a Seychelle gravity filter, with water flowing from an MSR Dromedary bag (I will replace it with a DromLite at some point). When I get to camp at night, I fill the water bag, hang it over a tree branch, and let it work on its own. I haven’t weighed my filter, but a review on backpackgeartest gives the weight as 3.1 ounces.

Before buying the filter (available at http://www.seychellewater.com/products.htm) I had read a couple of reviews on backpackgeartest which made me wonder about the durability of the filter. However, it only costs $21.95 plus shipping, so I figured I could afford to try it. I have not had any problems with durability, although I am careful with the filter when I unscrew it to dry it out after a trip. I have made one modification to the out-of-the-box setup, by adding a small piece of stainless steel coil pot scrubber to the intake hose of the filter, to prescreen out some of the larger gunk.

Things I like about the setup:

  • Much lighter than a pump filter (I had carried a Pur/Katadyn Hiker before this setup).
  • No work at all
  • No measurement of chemicals or thought required
  • I like carrying a water bag, because it gives me flexibility to camp away from water and still be able to wash up/etc. It’s a luxury, but this setup is lightweight and still lets me have the water bag.
  • No chemicals or chemical taste.
  • Filter can be cleaned by backflushing, unlike the Hiker.

Things I don’t like:

  • Getting clean water mid-day is more difficult than it would be with chemical purification. I haven’t found this to be much of a problem in practice. If I need water, I just plan to take a snack break at the same time. It usually takes 10 or 15 minutes to filter two quarts of water. This is more time than pumping two quarts would be, but a lot less work.
  • Weighs more than chemicals.

Overall I think it’s a fabulous system and would recommend it. It certainly beats my Hiker by miles – and a Seychelle filter costs less than a Hiker replacement cartridge.

Sweetwater used to make an in-line filter which is now out of production, but some outfitters still have some in stock (my local outfitter in Philly does, for example). The Sweetwater filter weighed about the same, included a prefilter steel coil, but needed to be “primed” before use. I like the Seychelle setup myself, but you may be able to find the Sweetwater filter if you want that one.

Bunchberry

Bunchberry

#18

Just a note on using Vitamin C to eliminate the chemical taste. I believe this is only true for Iodine-based treatment. Potable Aqua has what they call PA Plus neutralizing tablets, which are just Vit C.

I don’t think Vit C does anything to improve the taste with ClO2-based treatment (Aqua Mira). But sugar-free Kool-Aid works wonders, even at half strength, and is much lighter than regular Kool-Aid mix.

Wedding Singer

#19

Am I the only one that doesn’t taste aqua-mira?

Dog Tag

#20

I think I replied to your last post & recommended the carbon filter w/pump & coffee filter. Reading the above though, it is fascinating to see that !LIGHTWEIGHT! has become the new religon, replacing Catholicism & football. It has devout followers and heretics alike.

That aside, think about this:

  1. If you are starting early in the year, it will be interesting to see if your gravity filter gives a liter before freezing into a 16 pound block.

  2. Chemicals ARE temperature dependent. If that water is 40 degrees, you must add time before consuming.

  3. I personally don’t want to find out the cumlative effects of chemicals on my body.

  4. Chemically treated brown beaver pond water is still brown water.

While my First Need filter weighs a pound, I like the water that comes out of it. I hope this gives food for thought. Remember: Opinions are like rear ends. Everyone has one, but some really stink.

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